potential work problems

Hey everyone, I really could use some help.

I am fairly sure that I have found the person I want to be with for the rest of my life. Everything is falling into place on it - although obviously things can change, and a face to face is a big part of that, but it's going very well to say the least, and my cynical instincts tell me that this is The One. Probably. Possibly.

The trouble was - I didn't think the immigration rules had changed. How naive of me. Now, I have done some rather late homework and am stunned (and so is she - she thought marriage in the PH would gurantee it). Going through this site, and the governments (rather complicated) website rams it home to me how different to reality my perceptions of the procedure were. The 18,600 poses difficulty in my line of work - primary supply. I am a good teacher, and getting full-time is not a huge issue - those who have done it or are doing it know how stressful and taxing the job is in pretty much all schools, certainly in this part of the world. Quite frankly, I'd rather not do it, and I live well enough on supply. But getting 18,600 on supply is very difficult. It can be done, with luck and good health, and actually I am on course to do it - although there's a long way to go.

The problem is - since it's through an agency, and my money varies, and technically I am not guranteed any work at all - how would the immigration department see this? Especially since on supply, I have only earned 17,000 once in five previous years of supply. My instincts say - no chance. Also, even if this entry was given the go-ahead...what about the two/five years (I am confused) of qualifying period to keep her in the country, would I have to sustain that amount, and if so, what dates would be counted and how?

If this is the case, it's annoying. I am good at doing an important job which I like and it suits me, I pay my taxes, I earn a decent amount...and yet, I apparantly cannot 'provide' for someone else, who would easily be capable of coming and working part-time almost straight away, and actually would be glad to, even though they wouldn't have to - I could provide anyway. Rant over, it is the way it is. Any advice? (I'm not giving up, that's for starters!)

I think it would be worth seeing if you could secure a full time job, or maybe a part time job to get you over the threshold. Remember the loved one will only be able to work straight away in the UK if you marry her first in the Philippines and you bring her here on a spouse visa. If she comes here on a Fiancée visa then you are given six months to marry and afterwards you apply for a FLR(M) which is another thousand quid, then she can apply for a NI and begin her job search.

Note that the whole process isn't cheap whichever route you take, take it from a man who knows, it isn't cheap when you add everything up as the other boys and girls will tell you here.

If you have the will and the love for her, then you will find a way of getting her here with you

The process now takes five years, 1 x Fiancee visa + 2 x FLR and finally the ILR which can be followed by citizenship, until she is at that stage then she can have no recourse to public funds although she is entitled to the NHS services as soon as she arrives.

You can knock off one of the FLRs above if you bring her here on a spouse visa giving her an initial 2.5 years in the UK before applying for FLR.

I hope its not too confusing, I know you are just starting out.

Cheers Timmers. Oh, and the power of extreme stubbornness!

Extreme example - as I am from Northern Ireland originally, I declare myself Irish (which is my right, and supported by Britain), move to Ireland, and according to the Irish Immigration website:

So, the best thing for Visa Required Nationals to do is marry their Irish spouse overseas and then enter Ireland with a Spousal Visa. Whatever the paperwork hassle, in the end anyone married to an Irish citizen has the right to reside here. Eventually, the paperwork snarls will be cleared up...

Last option if all else fails. I've enjoyed my time in England, and I hate to play the Irish card, but what can you do... Can't find nothing about any money needed to support a spouse, but the teaching might be impossible on an English PGCE (like it is in practice in Scotland) - might have to retrain. This is how serious I am!

If you're serious then you will find a way, that's for sure.

I assume that the visa requirements would be the same in NI as here, maybe I'm wrong as I am assuming that because its part of the UK, Southern Ireland may be different.

You need to get yourself over to CDO, I worked near there years back, cant remember where, I just remember that its about 30 minutes flight from Manila.

If you haven't been to the Philippines yet then you have some lovely surprises in store, you'll love it!

No, I live in the UK now, in the Manchester area. I wouldn't bring her to Norn Iron - it's sadly too racist and many there would not get out relationship.

Being born in Northern Ireland, under the Irish Constitution, I have a right to Irish citizenship, or possibly dual nationality, and Britain supports this (from the Anglo-Irish agreement of '85, I think). If I changed my citizenship, then I could marry her outside Ireland and bring her to the Republic of I, on what was said in the last post. When she got EEU citizenship, we could come back to the UK. That is, if everything I have seen so far is correct.

(Ireland can interpret an EEU directive differently, since arranged marriages there seem to be carried out by non-Irish citizens, whereas in the UK there are generations of migrants from countries who are encouraging arranged marriages and are now UK citizens - this is the only constructive reason for the 18,600 I can see, to stop the arranged marriages by discriminating against economic groups rather than race, which of course would be illegal...)

But I want to see if I have a chance without taking this measure - I'm proud of my Norn Irish roots, and the whole of Ireland, but I won't renounce easily a country that has been very good to me, and a country where I have nearly lived half my life. I'd actually feel like a traitor, in a way.

The problem with all of this is that such a fine eye for rules and regulations is needed, and I'm not great at that...yet.

Oh I'm going. And she's delighted that I am not quitting. I would for anyone else.

I've spent three months in the PH before and loved it, although dengue fever wasn't fun...haha idiot me. I was fined at the airport for not having my stay extended through the proper channels...I ended up back in the UK with £3.5o or so left to my name. Just had enough to catch the bus from the airport home!!!

If you apply from the UK then a lot of us here would be able to help you with the paperwork, its daunting at first and there are always little hurdles to jump over, but it can be done.

That's the spirit.

"The process now takes five years, 1 x Fiancee visa + 2 x FLR and finally the ILR which can be followed by citizenship, until she is at that stage then she can have no recourse to public funds although she is entitled to the NHS services as soon as she arrives.

You can knock off one of the FLRs above if you bring her here on a spouse visa giving her an initial 2.5 years in the UK before applying for FLR.

I hope its not too confusing, I know you are just starting out."

I don't even know how to quote yet!! haha.

I am very very confused. I am getting there, though.

What is a FLR? - Leave of Residence...?

The pay is the problem, still.


...missed your earlier post about getting over the threshhold. Will read it properly. Appreciate it, thanks. And what you said about the paperwork...thanks again. This is happening.

FLR stands for further leave to remain, ILR stands for Indefinite leave to remain, you'll get used to it.

Go full time for a year. Go on, you can do it!

Once she is on a spouse visa she can work and I believe her own salary will also count towards the total.

I agree. You mention using your ability to acquire southern Irish citizenship and use that as the basis for bringing-in your (future) wife without UK visa restrictions as an EEA citizen. I'm not entirely sure you can do that as UKVI would view your change of citizenship as an attempt to circumvent immigration rules.

welcome to this friendly forum.

The trouble was - I didn't think the immigration rules had changed. How naive of me.

yep--lots of us were caught out when the rules changed 2 years ago.

in your case---best thing is get a full time salaried job--and wait for 6 months payslips proving a pro rata income of £18,600. if you fall short--savings count--so check out the rules for that.

Wow, I've been away from this site for too long. This post is long dead, but I will clarify this point, as it might be of use to someone in the same boat.

As a citizen of Northern Ireland, I automatically qualify for Dual Citizenship under the Good Friday Agreement signed by both the government of Ireland and the UK. I qualify by birth.

Many citizens of Northern Ireland will not see themselves as both, due to their own beliefs. I don't have that problem. I know I have roots in Ireland, and, with an english mother, roots in England, and Britian (which I don't have to have.)

I have my Irish passport here. I applied for it, and got it easily. It was cheaper However, I am still a British citizen, and am entitiled to renewing my British passport. I do not have to renounce British citizenship, nor would I want to - I would be betraying part of my roots.

The passport is irrelevent to UKVI, as my dual nationality is protected. My passport cannot advantage me or disadvantage me in the UKVI process, as I am still a British citizen in their eyes, until I declare myself not to be British.

The purpose of getting an Irish passport would be to bring a future wife to live in Ireland. I would need an income of about 13,000 pounds. Also, Irish customs are more supportive of people in this situation, and do not see the system as something to make money from - which seems to be the case of the British system.

So, my options are to move to Ireland (although teaching jobs are harder to come by), move to Dubai, which is my favourite option, or get a full-time job here. Working constantly on supply, I made 17,800 last year - which is annoying, but proves that a full-time job would be necessary. However, I am not cribbing and crying when I say that this is far more difficult than you might imagine. I've done many different types of work, long shifts etc. and it is by far the most demanding in terms of time and utterly destroys work-life balance - unlike in Scotland, Wales or Ireland. I'm giving it a go for a term in a tough school, and I will see how I get on but I'm sad to say that, like a rapidly increasing amount, I think that I just don't have it in me, or even want to work in such conditions - conditions pretty much unique to education in England.

A friend of my wife's husband is in a similar position. He is from Northern Ireland - born there and spent most of his life there. He explained he has that dual nationality and his wife benefits from that. They currently live in IOM, but they still get that benefit of dual nationality.

Another much easier option is to get a teaching job in Eire or anywhere else in Europe (plenty of jobs in Spain/Portugal to name but two) after you are married your Wife can join you for free with a Schengan 90 day visa after which you both can apply for family member residence cards 3-5 months living and working in the host country you can if you wish return with your Wife to the UK again for free and apply for EEA2 a 5 year residence card with no English test,no nhs subsidy, no TB, no life in the UK and only an £65 plus biometrics (about £20) This is called Surinder Singh Route and is very popular

Heres a starting place look in the files for a newbies guide to Singh

. https://www.facebook.com/groups/alison48amanda48/


http://www.scribd.com/doc/231192464/Surinder-Singh-for-Newbies

Irrelevant since Akrich 2003 https://eumovement.wordpress.com/2007/04/16/choosing-to-use-eu-law-instead-of-national-law/

No. As the OP says, those from Northern Ireland can have dual nationality. This works in their favour when it comes to bringing a non eu spouse back to the UK.