There are always relatives, my understanding of it was that the land would fall to the next closest Philippine relative, a sister a brother an auntie, whatever, you might then be allowed to stay on at the mercy of the new owner but of course you might not. If she tried to leave the property to you the will would probably be null and void and that would be basically the same as dying intestate where you would have a free for all amongst the surviving relatives. This was one of the first things I ever researched over there, made me think very hard at the time. edit: just had another wee google and came over this opinion http://philfaqs.com/live-there/land...oreigner-can-inherit-land-in-the-philippines/ This makes interesting reading and is very different to what I had read previously.
The above is from one of the blog comments on that page I referenced and appears to be from a Filipino lawyer.
Q1.. As far as I can tell..When your wife dies,according to Filipino family law you are accorded some rights as an inheritor but I believe this is only deemed valid if you are able to sell the property within a reasonable amount of time after the death of your wife.. Definition of "reasonable is unclear"..To me at least.. Q2.. Same as above.. At least in my understanding. Dont forget... If you have kids with her then they have priority inheritance.Thats a good thing except that they are responsible for inheritance tax which is payable on the death of the owner...Again,,Thats only In my understanding and Im only a poor Polish wannabee In other words...Dont take any notice!!
Very much appreciated guys. Yes, a lot of food for thought.... and I need to do a lot more reading & research on this topic. Thankfully, it's nothing that's gonna happen/occur in the near future. BBJ
First the best advise, by my "lawyer". (A former Surpeme Court Judge, one of the very same who decided the Case of that mentioned German prior in this thread) It is good "Practise" and legally accepted that upon marriage one draws an 'USUFRUCTU" agreement, entiteling you to use the Property until the end of your natural life. In General to Testaments, not only in th Philippines... Testaments can be fought in court, so it may be a good idea to have all her sibblings sign the Testament upon draft, that they agree with it and will not fight it after the demise of your wife. (same anywhere in the world) If one has kids, its hypothetical, they are #1 in the legal inheritence. With kids one can draw a document having everything in their name and just give "custody" to them until they are 18 or legally allowed. Somewhere else someone posted a Tip to have a Lease Agreement with his wife... that is actually not perfectly legal between Married people... be careful.
Now just a General remark.... It does not matter if Philippines or UK, we tend to overlook often, that many poor Hubbies loose half or more in Dovorces in the UK or elsewhere in the West. The Philippines is not much different in that matter. Everyone stares like a rabbit to the fact that foreigners can not own land and think its a very bad biased nation. Well, in reality almost ALL expats i met in the past 27 years have either NOT made any bad experience or (the few excemption usually ranting around negatively) have brought it upon themselves. Commonly this LEADS to Separation/Divorce/loosing everything after People moved to the Philippines with their wifes : 1.) They became hoepless alcoholics with all the ngatives effects. 2.) They abused their woman 3.) They became womanizers 4.) They never assimilated in their new surroundings and became bitter, bad man. 5.) or all of the above Then the "bad" wife could not handle it anymore and kicked the butt of the guy out, often associated with a "new" guy. The same happens in the western world, and only after the guy realizes his mistakes, but often do not admit it. On the other hand i have ( i like positive experiences) met three guys which got kicked out, changed completely back to a lovebal person and after a while ( 6 months up to three years in those cases) reconsiliated with their wifes. It worked and she took him back and they live happily ever after... (No joke) So as a rule of thumb, if one hear all those "bad stories" about Filipinas ripping of the hubbies, think twice, as the though is often the father of all negatives. being careful is fine, but honestly (and logically), if one trusted his wife for 10 to 30 years, and then retires in the Philippiens, WHY would that change ? Just asking ... ( btw.- i have been divorced from the wife and i still sit in my house/Restaurant in the Philippines, so i have a bit of experience in that matter, although the points 1-5 in this Post did not apply to me.)
I would always rent first before buying. At least it would provide time to research the pitfalls before buying When I lived in Spain, the amount of people who got taken to the cleaners was vast when they bought quickly. I get the feeling there would be more pitfalls in Phils
Sorry for the late response,somewhat i didnt see that Questions. Q1-she can not really leave a house/lot to you, but can manifest an "usufructu" until the end of your natural life. Like a Lease for free, and nobody can remove you. Q2- just like in other countries,spouses don't really have rights,its always the blood relatives and next of kin. Worse so in the Philippines. However, often ( and it happened a few times) the families don't insist on their "rights", and let the spouse live until he dies. Of course there are horrorstories,but most are caused by a prior"misbehavious" of the expat causing "dislike". And eventually revenge for his years of "non support and arrogance". One can now interpretate that as he likes. Q3- mmmh, as said and answered in Q1, and Q2, one has no rights. From the immigration POV there is an inofficial "policy" that a remaining spouse is 'allowed" to spend the rest of his days, specially when children are involved. If not,as well,but i only know 2 cases where the wife died, and in both cases nothing really happened/changed. The family supported the guy morally and after a few years in one case even a new marriage was welcomed ( cousin actually of the wife ) No question,but as a legal "trick" foreigners are allowed to own a house they build, but not the ground its sitting on. Through some legal works there is a possibility to use this "owned" house forever, even to pass it on to eventual heirs, but one has to makea contract at a Real Estate specialized lawyer.Its a complicated arrangement, similar to the 60/40 subdisivion or condo arrangement, where foreigner actually own an entirehouse/lot,but in reality its based upon a corporation which on is a shareholder and gets a piece of the entire subdivision including the house or Condo. As said, its complex, i know how it works, but one needs a forum for that alone. And the ownership ruling will change in a few years. On the possibility to become a "resident",its actuallyeasy,the 13aorother Visas are already fulfilling those conditions,but itdoesn't change much on ownership.(yet) To become a Filipino one needs to be basically at least 10 years in the Philippines as a resident and then its a simple application letter and an act of a congress(man) to become a citizen. One must surrender his former citizenship and fullfill a few easy conditions. Congressman ? Well one part of the conditions is to speak the language (any Pinoy dialect) and to proof sufficient mingling with the Pinoys, or better said, being part of the social life. If one hasn't aquainted with a congressman within the ten years, he probably mingled wrong. Alternatively one can also use a lawyer and pay outrageous amounts 100-200k for the process. But still has to fullfill the conditions.
Excellent post Guenther. I will formulate my own thoughts on this and give a reply later. Exactly this problem has been nagging at me for a while. One point is, if building a house in PI, to have all the receipts in the foreigners name. I am a "belt and braces" type and promises and tricks are never counted on by me. Thank you, Tom Addendum... OK... I am 65 and Tex is 27. As we know, those of us married/Etc. to Filipina, future financial planning and the making of Wills is not received well and strongly considered "tempting fate". When we marries Father gave Tex a 1/2 acer of his land to build our home on. At that time I was only concerned with providing for Tex's future. Some while later I considered more long term, regarding my future and Tex's, as the land is in Fathers name. The solution Father agreed to was to gift other land to Tex on the roadside beside tex's two sisters and one brothers house's the other side of the BRNG = more valuable land in fact. Their houses were also on Fathers land and no title in their name. Father did transferr title to Tex and that is settled and registered. There was much weeping and wailing by the wommenzz about this but the men are happier as their home plots are now secure. "You can trust my family (9 siblings) no one would do anything wrong as they all know the house is mine and all agree" Tex exclaimed amid tears. Fine I said then settle it legally. Father readily agreed when finally asked. Now 8 sisters may, and I have found them eminently so, be fair and reasonable in the future but that leaves 8 brothers-in-Law. ?? Having the title in Tex's name is of no value to me other than peace of mind and that is very important. I am Irish so "The Land" and its problems are well known to me. As an aside..... My home farm, now run by my Cousin is two parcel's of land on two different roads but the rear of each parcel is only 100 yards from the other. Two fields, owned by a neighbouring farmer, seperate them. This farmer put these fields up for sale. My cousin asked to buy them as he could save hours each week not having to go on the road from one to the other. The farmer refused to sell to my Cousin saying "Oh NO if I sold to you then you could drive from Carrow to Lishi across MY fields". They, the two families, had been on friendly term for generations. Still are in fact but my cousin told Tex last week "He (the neighbour) wouldn't be able to sleep at night if he thought I might get those two fields". See the film "The Field" for further insight into Thick Paddy thinking regarding "The Land". :-( Back on topic - always keep it legal in regard to PI land and houses. Any disagreement with loved ones over settling these things legally will quickly pass IMExp. Tom
Pheew, that's a long "addendum" and a lot of complex situations described. I'll try to give my humble POV. The house build on Tex land. It is technically yours, or could be arranged easy so. (Usufructu agreement at a Notary Public,one could also build in "just compensation" for the house in case you want to sell the house/lot or give it to the family ) But if the situation arouse, thatTex perishes before you, the question would be,if you would be willing to live theremainder of your days in the neighborhood of the family still? Most likely a new Marriage is unlikely welcomed by them, so you may would be very lonely. farm issues is that in Ireland or Philippines ? I assume the ladder, but then i can't answer that. In General Any family issues in those situations are headache, "heir" troubles area universal phenomen all over the world. I personally would choose to walk away if they arise, taking what i can in order to be happy for the reminder of my days. The closer the prozimitytothe sibbling/heirs,themorepro0blematic situations can beaome,but its very complexand can not be answered universally. I.E. in my case the family of my wife "outfortunes" me in huge numbers, so there would most probably nobody be interested in my(our) house/lot at all. But some families of Expats wifes are pretty poor and when faced with a hard life based upon daily survival generousity is often secondary. Understandable too. If my old mother tells me post ww2 stories ( often in shame) it was also a "grab what you can" mentality among the surviving German population. We westerners, blessed by (now) wealth an security often overlook this and condenm such behaviour without thinking about it.
From my understanding the constitution allows you to inherit the land and the house in those circumstances. http://pinoytimes.ca/2011/04/the-ph...er-filipinos-inherit-land-in-the-philippines/
This unfortunately only applies to natural born former pinoys, which have lost/surrendered their citizenship. Section 7 is a little confusing, but get "explained" in Section 8 . Section 7. Save in cases of hereditary succession, no private lands shall be transferred or conveyed except to individuals, corporations, or associations qualified to acquire or hold lands of the public domain. Section 8. Notwithstanding the provisions of Section 7 of this Article, a natural-born citizen of the Philippines who has lost his Philippine citizenship may be a transferee of private lands, subject to limitations provided by law. More here for interested people, Chan robles has an excellent library: http://www.chanrobles.com/article12.htm#.UECvo_L1OXs And Philippine laws are good and easy to read even for layman as us.
Firstly Guenther I am quite content with our situation in PI. "Our" existing home is on Fathers land. Given to us (Tex) but I know that with all his and families "good will" this gift in reality belongs to him legally. It is called "Tom's house" but Title would never be mine. That was never a worry for me and is not now. Long term I doubt I would want to remain there without Tex. When we return to PI next year Tex wants, as I do, to build on her "Legaly Titled" land, also gifted by Father, and I feel I might want to continue there without Tex. It is in the hands of time and fate. I will however have all the receipts Etc., on the new building, in my name and fully do not think I would want to stay on if ever alone again. It is the broaching of the subject that IMO has to be pushed in PI. For the good of the Lady in my case. I will retain my (Our) UK property in any case. The Farm is in Ireland - The Field film is an Irish tale of conflict over land in rural Ireland. My post was to give the backround of my situation which might give others ideas to their advantage in building in PI. The Irish bit was just my story telling.? "An aside" as stated. Thank you, Tom
Yeah Keith that has crossed my mind too, I would like security for my family but for me personally renting makes a lot of sense.
we currently rent a townhouse in the province for 6,000 pesos, nothing flash but clean and presentable, when I get there full time we will probably upgrade as I will want a bit more room for a garden, boat storage etc. probably 10,000 to 12,000 tops. To own a reasonable sort of house there would probably cost about 3 million, that's 25 years of rent at 10,000 pesos and does not include the cost of repairs and renovations as pointed out earlier. I suspect that many members here have been married on more than one occasion, and when you first get married you think that you and your sweetheart are going to be happy ever after, unfortunately life doesn't always work that way. The only way I would buy in RP is if I felt that I could afford to just take the hit and walk away from the whole venture at some stage in the future and know that from a financial point of view I will still be totally secure.. If you have the financial re-sources then go ahead and do it, if not then renting is the better option.... There are plenty of other ways to make provision for your wife and children after you are gone, I think I prefer easy access to funds in cases of emergency and the freedom to uproot with short notice if neccessary...
Its always a bit of a difficult "fencewalk" for me to answer directly to one's individual situation and at the same time also answer for the People in General Public which often has very different situation/problem. Then often misunderstandings occur, as one situation is not necessarily the other persons one. I personally choose more often to sacrifice the more personal answer in order to answer for the general public.
