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Labour's Woes Deepen

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion and Ethics' started by Markham, Aug 5, 2016.

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  1. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    JC changes like the wind, history will not be kind to him that I'm sure of.
  2. Bluebird71
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    Bluebird71 Well-Known Member

    Rupert Murdoch won't be kind to him :)
  3. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    The latest YouGov voting intentions poll makes grim reading if you're a Labour Party supporter:

    upload_2017-1-19_15-56-37.png

    If that wasn't bad enough, the Tories now lead Labour by three points in Labour's traditional heartland, the north of England where 37% would now vote Tory whilst 34% would stick with Labour.

    Corbyn's Trumpesque make-over for the new year has been an unqualified success :poop:, then!
  4. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    Well, there will be many people like myself who have voted Labour all their lives and now have no over options but to either abstain from voting or vote for another party.
  5. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    Labour has selected Gillian Troughton as its candidate for the forthcoming by-election at Copeland rather than the Corbynista candidate, Rachel Holliday. This west Cumbrian constituency used to be known as Whitehaven, was held by Jack Cunningham for 22 years and whose current MP, Jamie Reed, resigned in order to take up a new role as Head of Development and Community Relations for Sellafield Ltd. Reed's majority was just 2,564 over the Conservatives. Needless to say, Ms Troughton is not one who admires or even likes her leader: she promotes tweets saying "it’s political madness to vote for Corbyn" and tweeting articles entitled "Corbyn’s past will destroy Labour’s future" and "Jeremy Corbyn literally makes no sense".

    Copeland voted 62% in favour of leaving the EU but Ms Troughton is an arch-Remainer who publicly supports any attempt to frustrate the Article 50 process and who firmly believes - and has called for - the referendum result to be "declared void". Support for Labour has been steadily ebbing away since 1997 whilst the Tory share of the vote has increased so there's some kind of twisted logic in appointing a candidate whose views on the single-most important topic of the day, the EU, are diametrically-opposed to those of voters.

    A Tory gain in the making, methinks.
  6. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    I have a gut feeling that a lot of the core Labour voters that voted for UKIP last time around may well put their tick in the Conservative box.

    I think the new leader of UKIP Paul Nuttall needs to re-launch UKIP but unfortunately for him Mrs May has got a mid to hard Brexit covered so its going to be difficult. From a personal point of view I would like to see UKIP hanging around for a while at least until Brexit is sorted out.

    To me it just doesn't sit right that UKIP are going for Labours seats, just to keep the party alive.
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2017
  7. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    Paul Nuttall is standing in Stoke - Tristram Hunt's constituency - where UKIP came second in 2015 and where 75.4% of the electorate voted to leave the EU.

    I agree that, in Copeland, the Tories are the most likely beneficiaries of any Labour backlash although Ukip did beat the Lib Dems and came 3rd with 15.5% of the vote (the Lib Dems got 3.5%) in 2015.

    I have the distinct impression that the SNP may try to establish itself as a national party and fight seats south of the border. If it does so as successfully as it has been in Scotland, it will give the Scots far more power over English affairs, they could well annihilate Labour and the Lib Dems, just as in Scotland, and be a real threat to Brexit. Ukip is very necessary until Brexit is assured.
  8. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    The By-Elections in Stoke-on-Trent and Copeland will be held on 23rd February. I'm tempted to place a bet that they will be followed by a snap General Election in April or May.
  9. Methersgate
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    Methersgate Well-Known Member Lifetime Member

    There is no doubt that Mrs May has shifted the Tories onto UKIP's ground. She seems to have only one idea and that is it. The little flurry over grammar schools was another attempt to steal UKIP's clothes.

    People like me must just wait for the wheels to come off her Government.

    I do not think that the SNP will fight seats south of the Border; what they will do is to look for allies. In the short time since the last general election, the Tories have swung so far to the Right, and Labour has continued to disintegrate under the Trotskyites, that the SNP now look - as they did not, then - like a respectable coalition partner.

    I am still waiting to see what this government of flakes and frauds propose to do about Northern Ireland.
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  10. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    I agree that May shifted the Tories onto UKIPS turf, not only that, I'm sure a lot of UKIP voters would feel more comfortable voting for May (Conservatives), UKIP still has a little stigma attached to it.

    On another point regarding UKIP, Nigel Farage is UKIP, I do not believe his shoes can be filled, who else can UKIP push forward at media events who interviews as well as Farage? Love him or hate him he is good in front of camera I do not think a lot of people can deny that.
  11. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    Theresa May parked her tanks on Labour's lawns as soon as she became Prime Minister by well and truly occupying the centre ground of politics. Her Lancaster House speech reinforced this. The shift rightwards would only be perceived by those who are naturally opposed to the Tories but it is a perception not a reality.

    Coalition partner for whom? The Lib Dems??!! You only have 9 MPs and given your party's stance re Brexit versus the mood in the country, I doubt you'll achieve sufficient support until 2025 at the very earliest!! Seriously, the SNP currently poses the only effective opposition in the House of Commons despite its funereal, ghost-like leader and I can well imagine that Sturgeon would want to contest English constituencies; it might be her best tactic to secure her ambition - Scottish independence.

    Three words:
    1. Common
    2. Travel
    3. Area
    or one word:
    1. Irexit
    The latter alternative is unlikely unless Ireland loses big over its Corporation Tax plans because it will have suffered unfair discriminatory punishment not meted out to Luxembourg or Hungary. The Irish have far more in common with the British than with continental Europeans and that commonality might seal their fate.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 20, 2017
  12. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    It appears that the Labour and Ukip contenders in Copeland are engaged in a pissing contest over who has the greater NHS credentials. Labour's Gillian Troughton is billed as having a "lifelong career as a NHS doctor and surgeon". But that is not exactly true. Having cost the NHS at least £240,000 - being about the cost to train her to become a houseman (junior doctor) - she was a junior doctor at Kent and Canturbury Hospital for eight months in 1991, then a junior surgical doctor at Frimley Park Hospital for another seven months until February 1992. She then gave up the medical profession for a career as a school governor and councillor. There is no Gillian Troughton in the General Medical Council’s list of Registered Medical Practitioners. Hardly a "lifelong career", then. But she is a good metaphor for Labour's approach towards the NHS.

    The Ukip candidate, Fiona Mills, has worked for the NHS for the last 24 years, most recently as an accountant where she "worked closely with clinicians to try to deliver quality services for patients and value for money for taxpayers". Not exactly a nurse, though at least she’s worked in the NHS for more than a few months.

    Ukip 1, Labour 0.
  13. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    Labour's candidate for Stoke-on-Trent is the Corbyn-hating arch Remainer, Gareth Snell, who backs Turkey joining the European Union.

    According to his Twitter feed, Snell backed Owen Smith in the Labour leadership election, blasting Corbyn as an "IRA supporting friend of Hamas" who "took money and worked it at the Iranian state and broadcast in their state run TV channel.".

    [​IMG]
    Snell is contesting a constituency that voted 75.4% in favour of leaving the EU. Ukip's candidate, Paul Nuttall, is surely overjoyed at the news.
    [​IMG]
    Labour should take a leaf out of the Lib Dems' playbook - they've just appointed a Brexiteer as their candidate to take on Tory MP Andrew Bridgen in his Leave stronghold of North West Leicestershire at the next election.
  14. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    The encounter between Jeremy Corbyn and Theresa May at Prime Minister's Questions this week went well. For the Prime Minister. The fun starts at 1 min 58 secs with a planted question fed by a Tory backbencher which took the wind out of Corbyn's sails - but not before he mourned the death of a living Police Officer thereby demonstrating how ill-prepared he is for his job.

    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2017
  15. Aromulus
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    Aromulus The Don Staff Member

    Corbyn........... Long may he reign over Labour.................
    Best thing that ever happened to the Tories since the beginning of times...
  16. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    I'm not so sure. Most Tories are tiring of his ineptitude, inability to lead his party and hold the government to account. He cuts a tragic figure these days in his new ill-fitting shiny polyester suit (tailored in Pyongyang?) which he wore to PMQs yesterday. But he is good entertainment value - unless you are a Labour supporter.
  17. Dave_E
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    Dave_E Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    Theresa May handled Question time very well.
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  18. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    In my view we couldn't have a better leader in opposition as we exit the EU as JC and his party are all over the place and offering little resistance.
  19. Timmers
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    Timmers Well-Known Member Trusted Member

    In my opinion she is turning out to be the ideal Brexit Prime Minister, if she walks away from the EU negotiations with a good deal for Britain I will be very happy and vote for her at the next General Election.

    Having said that, I do not believe we will secure a good deal from the EU, I really cannot see it even though a lot of political commentators are saying it is of mutual benefit to grind out a reasonable deal. I believe the EU will cut off their nose to spite their face, I hope I'm wrong :)
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  20. Markham
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    Markham Guest

    I hope May is able to come away with a decent deal because not only would that be mutually beneficial, it would also help to heal the deep wounds of division that plague the country. Such a deal would probably give us unfettered access to the Single Market, allow us to strike our own trade deals with non-EU nations, remove us from the ECJ's jurisdiction and allow numerically-restricted free movement whilst allowing us to control borders. We will, I think, have to allow farmers to employ eastern European workers just as they do now otherwise any gains we enjoy from the removal of the CAP will be offset by increased wage costs - and nobody voted for higher food prices. By restricting the use of itinerant workers to the farming industry, the government can honestly claim to be reducing migration.

    Given the rather large - and growing - trade imbalance, the EU really has little option but to strike a mutually-acceptable deal. Unless it wishes to punish its exporters.
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